And while it can be hard depending on the heat treat, I have found it easily chips, causing microscopic dings in the edge when hardened to a high level on a thin blade. They make excellent everyday carry steels, especially for light- and medium-duty tasks. 1. I was struggling to simplify all the Rockwell/Youngs Modulus stuff for readers when I came across your site. Like S90V, its a high-hardness steel, but its more balanced than S90V. However, the relative difference in toughness between these different examples are similar. High wear resistance steels are more expensive to buy and to process, especially since many require powder metallurgy. I have not provided a rating for ease in sharpening. If you want to check the quality of my work, just search for The EDC Bible on Amazon. In addition, According to Sandvik, 14C28N steel is easy to work on, reducing production costs and hence affordable knives. Im a layman trying to understand what makes the best steel for my use. Steel high in carbides cant be stamped out; it must be cut by a waterjet or laser, which takes time and is more expensive. Powder metallurgy is a technology designed to maintain a small carbide size. Like 154CM, there is a newer version, S35VN, which shares many of the same attributes as S30V but is easier to craft into a knife thanks to niobium. A more obtuse edge angle is much more resistant to chipping than an acute edge. But it would be my recommendation for applications requiring extreme corrosion resistance. CRKT and Spyderco use BD1. Also I notice 1095 looks like another underperformer as there doesnt look to be any reason to use it over 5160 which I cant imagine is any more expensive than 1095. ), intended use will give you all the answers. Its found on a large number of traditional-style folders. This is a bit of a guess because I cant find un-notched Charpy data on it. Hi Jimmie, thanks for your comments. I like it in the Seki City Spydercos, but I would like to know what ratings you would give it. Its very corrosion-resistant and quite tough. You do not expect the prices to be as low as those of low-end knives, but you will get high performance at affordable prices with either. 14C28N. Heres The Best Review For You (2021), D2 knife blade offers high edge retention, Dulls faster, Requires frequent sharpening. Very acute edges are more brittle but remain sharp for longer and cut very well. AEB-L and 14C28N are the best in the high toughness group. Most production knives are more than thick enough at the edge to accommodate a regrind to significantly improve performance, and its a lot cheaper than buying a new knife a lot of the time. Why wouldnt it be possible to make a damascus steel out of (say) AEB-L and s90V, or wouldnt that gain the best of both? That is an air-hardening- high carbon, high chromium tool steel. And given the recipe, it has a low number of carbides, the extra-hard microcrystals in steel that provide the hardness necessary for a stable and sharp edge. You need a hard medium to sharpen it like diamond or boride. The studies confirmed that the primary controlling factors are hardness of the steel, volume of carbides, and hardness of the carbides. The maximum edge retention available in this group is not particularly high because most of the wear resistance comes from iron carbide, also called cementite, which is the softest of the different carbide types. I think you wrote an article a bit ago on CTS-XHP and concluded that like D2 and ZDP-189 it wasnt really stainless (although stainless is a somewhat arbitrary line). 14C28N VS S30V S30V steel provides improved corrosion resistance, sharpening ease, and edge retention. This steel is quite corrosion resistant and sharpens easily. Its not bad, but you can find better in the market at the same price. Most of the midrage ifferings have 14c28n, how does it compare to d2 in your experience? Available in Kershaw knives (as of 2012) and in other . However, Kershaw asked Sandvik to make their 13C26 steel more resistant to corrosion, and the result was 14C28N. A good quality knife must have sharpness, great edge retention, and a sturdy handle. Many knife enthusiasts are concerned with categorizing steels as excellent, good, poor, etc. This is one of the better steels on the market. show very different and even inversed behaviour (e.g. Divers, sailors, and anglers need knives that will resist corrosion above all else. H2 Most vintage tool blades seem to have been made of 1084/1095 or similar, presumably at some <60 Rc hardness that gave the required toughness, and the rules of thumb for sharpening angles are based on those assumptions. The Kershaw Leek is a most popular EDC knife that design by legendary custom knife maker Ken Onion. Get for a complete guide about other steel; you can read 14c28n vs 8cr13mov reviews. So we get back to my original question: if a D2 planer blade at 58 Rc and the associated level of toughness will perform acceptably with a 30 sharpening angle, is there some way to extrapolate at what sharpening angle another steel with higher toughness might perform equally well? Any idea where it would be on the hardness and toughness scales? Some steels are cooked up specifically with this in mind and are very difficult to make rust. 9cr18mov vs 14c28n. 14c28n steel and D2 steel are both high-quality knife steels. However,M390, CTS-204P, and CPM-20CV are all pretty difficult to resharpen, so maintain that edge! You cannot leave your 14C28N knives in water overnight and expect them not to rust. Spyderco announced Native 5 Salt with magnacut, but I saw test of magnacut with salt water and it grows corrosionso Salt with magnacut could be a flop. 14C28N knives offer excellent corrosion resistance and toughness. Spyderco has produced several production knives with Maxamet, and the steel debuted on the ZT0888. Deburring of edges often takes even longer than removing material to produce the edge. You can see that 64 Rc AEB-L has both lower toughness and edge retention than 61 Rc MagnaCut, so I feel that in general you get a better sense of where the steels fit with a single point. There are a lot of different types of steel out there . I have a Spyderco K390 knife and I cut leather with it as it is only .090 thick and I seldom have to strop it on 1 micron diamond compound on leather. My name is Jonathan M, and Im a passionate Mechanical Engineer, a knife enthusiast, and the author of this website. Conventionally produced steels include AEB-L, A2, 52100, 12C27, 14C28N, and AUS-8/,8Cr13MoV. But in use, Ive found nothing that withstands the abuse that 3V can take. Vancron would work well in a kitchen knife. On the positive side, they are very easy to forge and grind. The difference in properties between 14C28N and D2 steel is very clear. Toughness is the resistance to chipping or breaking. Could you please compare it to Shirogami #1 and Agomi #1, I didnt find anything in terms of grain size ragarding thoese steels on the Internert. D2 steel offers better edge retention and wear resistance than 14C28N. Later, it gets heated and compressed into one ingot. 14C28N and D2 steel are not the same. There is one exception: Bucks 420HC (Buck and onlyBuck) is produced using a proprietary heat treatment. I believe they are made of simple carbon steel. However, high wear resistance means that abrasives are used up more rapidly, more careful grinding is necessary to avoid overheating, finishing and polishing is much more time consuming, etc. This is a major tradeoff between improved cutting ability and edge retention with an acute angle vs a strong and chip resistant edge with an obtuse angle. If you purchase this types of knife, without any hassle you can easily re-sharpening. Therefore powder metallurgy is not necessary for certain steels, or could even be slightly detrimental. Read more about how it works here. Jesse Jarosz, a custom maker from Montana, regularly uses AEB-L. Its exceedingly tough and relatively hard, but its not stainless. Therefore, ensure to wash and dry your knives after use to keep the rust away. Because of their good edge retention, these steels are quite versatile in folders and fixed blades. The ultra high corrosion resistance steels Vanax or LC200N max out around 60-61 Rc instead. Read more. As a result, there are no production knives with REX 121 steel, though Ferrum Forge used the steel early on in its custom knives and a Kickstarter knife from the Creely Brothers. I love reading through all the data youve gathered and making note of all the trends (Im a physical organic chemist). 12C27 Theres a green triangle at about RC 60.5 and toughness over 40. LC200N has similar properties to those two but with saltwater levels of corrosion resistance. The 1.4116 I tested has large carbides in it which is presumably the reason for low measured toughness: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2019/05/26/new-micrographs-of-42-knife-steels/. But keep in mind that no steel is perfect for everything. I just want to thank you for all the work you do for the community and the world at large. Most steels use carbon to increase hardness, but 14C28N uses nitrogen, boosting hardness without the normal penalty of increased corrosion. rex 121 Having 1.5% Carbon does that. Steels 7Cr and below arent worth your time or money. We looked at common steels used by popular knife brands to help you select the right material for your blade. I was the heat treater, but after HT to only 58-59 hardness the blades went to the surface grinders for finishing and I remember them going into the packing boxes with mirror polished edges. Type 8Cr, the more common formulation, is worse than AUS-8: a little more prone to corrosion and not quite as hard. Spyderco offers this as the high-end steel for many of its evergreen blades, like the Paramilitary 2, Paramilitary 3, Manix 2, and Native 5. Hi Larrin Your estimate of 420HCs corrosion resistance is different here than in your October, 2019 post on corrosion resistance testing: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2019/10/14/corrosion-resistance-testing/ For example, see the chart below for how much edge retention can change with edge geometry for a single steel (in this case 154CM and CPM-154). Using 10 dps sharpening (20 degrees inclusive on the chart) leads to about 5x the edge retention of 25 dps. It also improves edge retention and strength. This is the steel used in Swiss Army knives and is excellent for beginner sharpeners. there seems to be an optimal procedure for every alloy (provided its heat treated to industial standards). the more complex fracture toughness at least lets you make some estimates in this sence. AR-RPM9 Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. So setting edge geometry for the type of knife and intended use is very important. I couldnt find much on 5160 steel and from a knife makers point of view if you are saying youre the preferred supplier of special ops than I dont understand this choice in knife steel. LC200N has similar properties to those two but with saltwater levels of corrosion resistance. That is professionaly popular such as the Japanese designation SKD11, Uddeholm Sverker 21, German designation 1.2379, Hitachi SLD and others. In general, higher carbon and higher vanadium steels have higher wear resistance and edge retention but lower toughness. 14C28N, designed by Sandvik at Kershaw's behest to have the edge properties of 13C26 but with increased corrosion resistance by adding nitrogen and chromium. There is a powder form, CPM-D2, and PSF27 is also very chemically similar. All of the experiments shown below are possible thanks to supporters. Its in the same class as Vanadis 8 and 10V. Spyderco and Cold Steel have used it, though Cold Steel recently switched to S35VN due to availability concerns. It is an excellent steel that in the right hands has proven to produce high performing blades. A few steels have been added since such as MagnaCut and M398. This makes for a great slicing knife and a perfect steel, in my opinion, for a regular-use, everyday-carry folder. Below I have shown the difference in carbide volume between AEB-L, CPM-10V, and Rex 121 to get an idea of how much more carbide there is in the high edge retention steels. Actually, Id be thinking 14C28N, but I want to leave stainless out. i understand the samples were treated in the same way. . S35VN The best steels with balanced properties include 4V/Vanadis4E, CPM-CruWear, and CPM-M4. If the properties of a knife meet your knife needs and it has the above characteristics, then it qualifies as a quality knife. Hi there, Though technically not a stainless steel at least 14% chromium, and D2 usually has 12% it's relatively corrosion-resistant. Its actually quite good, low-cost steel that performs like midprice steel. Marco, BSc Chem. This is a powder-metal steel also produced by Crucible. : knife a with a toughness of 5 and an angle of 20 degrees will perform as well in edge retention as knife b with a toughness of 3 and an angle of 15 degrees. Anyway, astute comment, but edge retention does mean a lot in woodworking. The following are less common steels, but theyre definitely worth tracking down. This is a non-powder Japanese steel used primarily in Spyderco knives. Working closely with our factory the heat treating of this steel has been perfected resulting in excellent performance for the price. Kershaw, Spyderco and Schrade are among some of the popular users of this steel.. 14C28N. On the flip side D2 steel is much harder than other steels in this category such as 154CM or ATS-34 and as a result holds its edge a little better. The critical difference between these two sheets of steel is their corrosion resistance. Between the assisted open, weird looking texture designs, and the stainless steel handle, the Cannonball has a lot of features I don't normally like, but even I have to admit it's a good design for the price. These are Chinese-produced steels that recently started showing up in Chinese-made knives. Many steel ratings seem to over-emphasize edge retention. Wear resistance comes from hardness and carbides, hard particles formed between carbon and another element like Vanadium or Tungsten. YMMV While higher hardness does lead to improved edge retention the bigger reason to have higher hardness is for resisting edge deformation. Sandvik 14C28N steel is better than D2 steel in corrosion resistance and toughness. Distilled water can separate steels that are stainless vs those that are not. You said wood is not a particularly abrasive material and in absolute terms that is very true. I can also say from personal experience that marine grade plywood will chaw up your saw blade and battery a lot quicker than standard plywood, but that probably says more about the glue that was used than the wood. 1095 Properties: 14C28N: D2: Edge retention: 4/10: 7/10: Ease of sharpening: 6/10: 3/10: Corrosion resistance: 4/10: 4/10: Toughness: . The big difference in properties vs the low alloy steels, however, are the harder carbides that are found in these steels. So, it is quite harder than most other steel variants and retains its edge sharp for a long period. Stainless steels are another subset of high alloy tool steels that have enough chromium in them to have stainless levels of corrosion resistance. Also, what kind of steel is used for utility knives? 14c28n vs. D2 Steel D2 is as rigid as 14c28n, thus has almost equal edge retention abilities. 14C28N steel is known to offer the highest toughness levels out there. Vancron has a very fine microstructure so it would be tough to beat. Spyderco is the only production company using this steel, though Michael Gavik of Gavko knives produced a number of customs in LC 200N. Wusthof Classic Ikon 8-Inch Cooks Knife Review, Victorinox Fibrox Straight Edge Chefs Knife Review, What is Cts bd1 steel? Also D2 is not stainless as at least 5% of its chromium is tied up in carbides where it doesnt help prevent corrosion. False treatment and geometry upheld by Made in USA is like buying 8Cr from China (except late A.G) My personal experience tops with Vanadis 4E, CPM-M4, RWL-34 and the likes. So the major tradeoff is in how much carbide you want in the steel for edge retention without dropping toughness too much for the intended knife and user. The Sandvik 14c28n steel is ideal for the manufacturing of steel knife blades. The old rule in steels used to be corrosion resistance, toughness, or hardness choose two. But SM100 (the trade name for Nitinol 60) threw that out the window when introduced to the cutlery world. Note:There is a powder-metal version called CPM154 thats purer than the non-powder version, making it easier for knifemakers to grind. You also reported 8.6 for 440A in that post, compared to 8.5 in this post. great work, larrin. I see tables that compare Toughness,Edge Retention,Corrosion Resistance. the following is not a critique, just a few thoughts to maybe put the relationships into a wider perspective and point to additional dimensions. We and our partners use cookies to Store and/or access information on a device. Mostly it has been presented piecemeal with all of the studies that we have done on optimizing heat treatments of different steels like CPM-CruWear, AEB-L, 52100, etc. 14C28N is thus ideal for use in corrosive environments and challenging applications. G10 Non-stainless steels can be heat treated to 66 Rc or even higher depending on the particular steel. These steels offer a great balance of characteristics that work well, from big choppers to thin slicers. The value being slightly different doesnt mean its an outlier or measurement error. With recommended hardness range of 55-62 HRC; the 14C28N is great for knife applications which place very high demands on edge sharpness, edge stability and corrosion resistance such as chefs knives, hunting knife, pocket knives and fishing knives.